1844 Half Farthing die variety

[KurtS]

I found this beautiful coin at a dealer today. I saw something in the lettering under the loupe, but I didn't make the connection with the E/N variety listed in Krause until I got home. But clearly under magnification, the E in REGINA is punched over an N.



detail of E/N:

[coop]

It does look interesting. Not that familiar with their minting techniques. But U.S. Coins during the same time had punched letters on their design. Probably there are several examples if this is the case as it probably happened on the hub that made several dies. Something to look for.

[KurtS]

Coop, I'm thinking Great Britain's coining techniques must be more similar to Canada's (past 1858), which had several examples of repunched lettering in the devices at the Heaton, UK mint in the mid-late 1800s. I'm not sure whether this happened to a die or hub (although wouldn't repunching a working or master die make sense?) Whatever the cause, the Canada varieties are quite scarce and command a 10x premium, as does this coin. I can only guess I stumbled upon another great find!

[coop]

Stumbling only applys to walking. LOL

If it happened on a master die, then all the coinage from that year that the hubs were made from would have the same anomoly. It a hub was at fault several dies would be affected. If it is only one die then only the coins from that die would be affected and make them a lot less.

[KurtS]

However you call it...I was not looking for this when I found it--fun when it happens! Yes--it would sure be interesting to know if only one die was affected. I always suspected the Canada varieties (Heaton UK mint) were individual dies, but I don't exactly have a population of coins for comparison.

[JRocco]

Hey Kurt,
Nice coin.
I have an 1844 half farthing and while I believe the coin is tucked away, I found some low res pics I had taken.
There does not appear to be any over-lettering on my example.
Hope this helps.

[KurtS]

Thanks for showing your coin--it's good to see what the normal E looks like. I notice other differences on the obverse die, such as the direction of tilt of the V in VICTORIA, the tilt of the colon between D:G, and perhaps the first A in BRITANNIAR? A few letter shapes look different too. This makes me wonder how these dies were made, and what degree involved hand-positioned punches?

I seem to recall the early US large cents I have involved a much higher degree of handwork in creating devices on the die. By Sheldon's guide, each die pair had a different position of LIBERTY, the date, reverse fraction, and other devices. By the era of small cents such as the Flying Eagle and "Indian Head", only the date was gang-punched into the individual die, with the remaining devices impressed by a working hub. By 1909, the date was part of the working hub. That's my recollection at least--anyone please correct me! I can only guess there was a significant change of technology somewhere in the mid-1800s? It would be fun to research!

Any thoughts as to what my coin would grade as? I'm rather unfamiliar with this series. :

[JRocco]

Hi Kurt,
I don't collect this series either, but your coin looks like a nice near gem example. The main points taken away from your coin would be the tough shape the rims are in. I would put it in the 64 range. I do like the surfaces and the fields look good. The device is a little ticky, but overall a nice attractive coin.
As to a discussion on early 19th century pieces, try looking at this thread:
http://www.coppercoins.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2493&start=0
This is a series that I actively collect and can tell you that even the dentils are hand punched on these coins, as well as every star and arrow feather.
Early 19th century coins are really interesting.

[coop]

Must have been a weak design on the reverses? They both have one/two die cracks on them. I don't know why, but older coins intrigue me. Maybe think of whose hands they had been through. People who have came and gone...... Truly history to me.

[Robert]

Nice coin!

[KurtS]

John, if my coin is a 64BN, that would be quite nice! Yes, it's too bad about the rims, but those marks are actually far less severe than my photos indicate; the rims are actually quite square.

Btw, I found an example of the E/N in AU with the same die break on the reverse in FARTHING. That's probably a good marker (PUP). This source also lists the coin as "rare" at £195 in AU. I paid all of $5.

That's quite a nice collection of early coinage. I also like the handwork evident in the early strikes. That 1817/3 is great! The sharpness there looks like an EDS perhaps? Someday I'll have to get back into those coins. It's a lot of fun to investigate die pairs and varieties.

[KurtS]

I was curious how these two obverse dies compared, so I overlaid an image of my coin with one from the "normal" die, which seems to match the other coin here.

While not an exact overlay, the portrait, denticles, and most of the legend line up well, except where noted by arrows. In these places, you can see the ghost image of the letters at different angles. Those are where letter positions on my coin differ.

[Dick]

Kurt, I was going to ask if it might be the angle from which you are viewing, that causes the optical illusion of bein slightly different, but then I thought, you don't use a ramp for photogtaphy. So much for that thought.
Dick

[KurtS]

Dick--I thought you'd enjoy this overlay! I'm pretty certain some of the letters on my coin are angled relative to others--particularly the V in VICTORIA. The denticles and portrait essentially match between coins. I could've used lines to compare directions of various baselines and strokes, but this suffices too.

[Dick]

Kurt, I did get a kick out of it! The position of the letters involved, was the reason I thought the angles might come into play. looking again, I notice the "V", "A", and the "I" , seem to be almost doubled, but fall short of actually being so. The other letters you pointed out are quite notable, too, to a lessor degree.
PS While I am thinking about it, I have a question: How do you make "links" with the regular letters and words? I have noticed in several of your posts, both here, and CCF. it is interesting, that it can be done. Would you care to explain, or is it a "trade secret"? I'll never tell!
Dick