Any 1980s cents worth it??

[coppercoins]

Anyone here think there's any value in hoarding any of the dates of cents in the 1980s in ligtly circulated condition, let's say AU? Give us your thoughts, then I'll share mine after a few days.

[cladking]

No! Certainly some of these are difficult enough to locate that there may well be a labor cost associated with them in a few years. There are going to be a lot more collectors in the next several years if the hobby is going to survive and lots of these people will collect cents from the 80's. As few of these as there are now there will be a lot fewer after more years of staggeringly high attrition, but it should be remembered that there are a lot of cents in circulation. Even if one has to look through 1000 cents to find a nice AU of some date, when you divide that into 100,000,000,000 it's still a big number. There is no gaurantee of anything so even the dollar or two one might predict such a coin commanding pales to the value of a BU roll of the same date. This might be bought for a dollar or two now and requires a great deal less effort than finding nice AU's. My own personal preference is to just save the really best coins. The effort level goes up somewhat, the costs go down, but if there's any demand at all it is the high grade coins which will be most in demand. The increased effort isn't so great as it might seem since I'm already looking for other high grade coins and varieties.

There are some great varieties already known for these coins and there are likely to be more discovered so having a nice AU might be pretty nice if there are none known in unc.

[n1tot]

Yes, I do belive collecting some of 80's is worth it, 1982 was a transition year where they went from copper to zinc/copper plate,also both small and large date.I also heard that someone had found a 1983 all copper when it should have been zinc/copper plated, not to mention that supposedly some of the 83's have doubled die reverses. 1984 the doubled die ear,in 85 there an article was written about one that was struck on a planchet for a foreign country, off-metal, brass I belive. That's my view on this, and by the way, the 83 all copper is 1 of 2 found, I wonder hwo many more are out there????????. I've been saving all my 83's, now all I need is a scale to weigh them. Always on the hunt.............. Brian B.

[coppercoins]

There's no need to weigh them, all you need to do is use the drop test to find out what they are made of. Zinc will make a dull thud when dropped on a table and copper will make a high pitched ringing noise. Try it with a few 1983 cents and a few 1981 or before cents and listen to the difference. A little practice and you'll be able to go through a roll of 1983 cents in less than a minute with 100% accuracy.

Good luck finding a brass (the actual metal the earlier cents were made from, 95% copper 5% zinc) 1983 cent. That's like finding a needle in a haystack of needles.

As for the doubled dies and odd errors - I don't believe those alone are any reason to hoard normal cents for a given year. Having 100 rolls of 1983 cents isn't going to make a doubled die any easier to find, nor is it going to change any of them into a die variety. Additionally, there are at least five different known doubled die obverses for 1983P cents - don't limit yourself to only looking on the reverses.

If you want to be technical about it, there are also valuable die varieties known for 1984D, 1985P and D, 1986P and D, 1987P and D, 1988P and D, 1989P and D, 1990P, 1991P, 1994P, 1995P, 1996P and 1997P, as well as the 1998P, 1999P, and 2000P type F reverse cents (commonly mistakenly called "proof reverse" or "type II"). Does that mean we should be hoarding ALL zinc cents? I don't think so. Additionally there's at least a decent chance that all the die varieties out there for this era have not yet been discovered, so limiting yourself to what's published may keep you from being the discoverer of something new.

My reason for asking whether we should be keeping nice examples of the early zinc Lincolns hinged simply on the fact that these rot into dust after a few short years of general circulation abuse, and have to be far less common than the brass cents of just a few years earlier. It had nothing to do with hoping they would change into die varieties or errors. I would think saving them, even in higher circulated grades, would yield quite a stash in 30-50 years when they truly are rare. That's just my own speculation, though.

[Bob P]

I tend to agree with you Chuck, but the rationale for putting away coins of the 80's can get much deeper than that. To a variety collector such as myself, let's consider RPMs for instance. Although there were many more coins issued in the 80's versus lets say the 50's, how easy is it to find 1980's era RPM's? It seems to me that it is a lot easier to find RPM's from the 50's. Could it be sheer numbers? Maybe, but the fact that there were a lot more coins made in the 80's doesn't always mean the varieties are easier, or more plentiful to find. A question maybe you can answer is....what is the approximate amount of strikes a die will make on a copper coin versus a zinc coin? I am curious because if a zinc planchet is harder on a die than a copper one, then any variety or any other thing for that matter that may go through a full die life would be less numerous that the other way around.
The 1980's did indeed have many remarkable varieties, many of which I have, but many more that I do not have as of yet. In that realm alone, I am always searching for rolls to search. Some of the 80's rolls are easy to come by, others are not. I will consider stashing away 1980's era coinage, but to what extent I am not sure. I believe that you are right on when you say the zinc cents seem to deteriorate much faster over time than the copper ones. To have some set aside, may indeed be quite profitable down the road. Whether or not I will be here to see it remains to be seen.

Bob P

[Robert]

Today I saw some 87D and 88D bank rolls for sale. Are they really up to $3.50 per roll?!?

[coppercoins]

Yes they are, and getting harder to find by the month, it seems. Rolls from the mid 50s seem to be more available than 1984-1989 rolls. I'm not exactly sure what it was that caused the shortage, but it's definately there.

[Robert]

Dang. Shoulda bought em, huh?

Are there any "key" zinc rolls?

[coppercoins]

Yup, I'd buy anything zinc as long as the end coins don't look spotty. 1984D and 1986P are keys, running more than $10 per roll (the 86P is getting close to $20 per roll).

[cladking]

The last time the market for Lincolns was tested was in the late 80's. At that time the 80's issues were too new to attract much attention so it was only the older copper cents that enjoyed much of a run-up. Since that time the market has not been able to maintain the high prices for the memorial coppers and they have come down quite a bit in price.

The market bypassed the zinc cents because it was more interested in other issues like Kennedys and Ikes. Now it is coming around to test the Lincolns again. In the interveneing years some of the zinc issues have done quite well so there should be some significant increases in the zincs for a couple years. The ones that go up the most will be the ones which weren't set aside in much quantity. I have to suspect this will involve many of the '82 to '96 issues and wouldn't be surprised to see some increases in some of the earlier coppers. At least the truly cheap rolls that have been having a lot of trouble with tarnish like the '68 should have some movement. There will be at least a few surprises and possibly some huge ones.

There are also lots of people updating their Lincoln sets. Most people stopped their collections after 1958 or 1964, many are now bringing them up to date. While none of the regular issue memorials are difficult in unc, there are some which are not common in nice attractive condition. Watch for choice and gem coins to get some attention too.

[coppercoins]

Thanks Cladking...that right there was an article worth publishing on the site. They don't have to be long, drawn out dissertations - just a couple of paragraphs with some good info like what you just posted.

May I publish that one, and add a title befitting? If so, under which name should I publish it? All I know you as is "cladking".

[cladking]

Certainly. Feel free to use it as you see fit. Most of what I've written has been under Sam Petry so please use that.

[Robert]

Bob - two things come to mind. First, I believe zinc is much softer than "copper" or brass or bronze. And second, I believe the reason RPMs etc are more common in the 1950s has more to do with changes made to the minting process. For example, recently (1997?) the Mint added the "D" mint mark to the master hub, thereby eliminating hand repunched mint marks.

(Correct me if I'm wrong, Chuck!)

[Bob P]

Hi Robert,
You are absolutely correct about the mintmark punches being placed directly on the hubs. That actually happened in the very early 90's. I think it was 1990. I was specifically talking about 1980s era RPMs. They were still being hand punched at that time. The "single squeeze" method of preparing hubs started in 1997, therefore you won't necessarily find any more doubled dies. There are a couple of exceptions, that being the 1997 doubled ear, and I believe a very minor 1998 doubled die reverse. The reverse hub may have been made long before 1998 which would explain why there is a doubled die for that year. I am still not quite sure about what happened with the 1997 doubled ear, but I am sure that Chuck can shed some light on that.
I am tending to agree that zinc is a softer metal, and thereby more coins may be struck from a single die. It still does not explain why it is more difficult to find RPMs from the 1980's.

Bob P